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Tuesday, June 15, 2004

Who Should Be A Christian Leader?

In light of the following passage of Scripture, do you think persons with children, who are rebellious, disobedient, etc. — not "submissive," should not be in or removed from pastoral ministry or lay leadership? Why or why not?



1 TIMOTHY 3:1-13 (ESV)
The saying is trustworthy: If anyone aspires to the office of overseer, he desires a noble task. [2] Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, [3] not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. [4] He must manage his own household well, with all dignity keeping his children submissive, [5] for if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church? [6] He must not be a recent convert, or he may become puffed up with conceit and fall into the condemnation of the devil. [7] Moreover, he must be well thought of by outsiders, so that he may not fall into disgrace, into a snare of the devil.
[8] Deacons likewise must be dignified, not double-tongued, not addicted to much wine, not greedy for dishonest gain. [9] They must hold the mystery of the faith with a clear conscience. [10] And let them also be tested first; then let them serve as deacons if they prove themselves blameless. [11] Their wives likewise must be dignified, not slanderers, but sober-minded, faithful in all things. [12] Let deacons each be the husband of one wife, managing their children and their own households well. [13] For those who serve well as deacons gain a good standing for themselves and also great confidence in the faith that is in Christ Jesus.

Comments on "Who Should Be A Christian Leader?"

 

Anonymous Anonymous said ... (4:59 PM, June 17, 2004) : 

Should we kick out priests and deacons who have difficult children? This passage seems to say so.

"if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church?" This seems pretty clear to my uneducated eyes.

Also, it seems to me that this passage supports the argument that only men can be ordained.

 

Blogger theultrarev said ... (11:34 AM, June 18, 2004) : 

... How many instances of disobedience does it take to qualify for having children that are not "submissive?" Is there a difference between a an instance and a pattern? How does grace apply here?

... Is there an age issue that comes into play? Does the text apply to 'unsubmissive' 17 year olds the same as it does to 5 year olds the same as it does to 37 year olds who just happen to live at home (done that myself)?

... I wonder if these verses have been thrown out with the OT Levitical code. We generally pick and choose from the 10 commandments and the other 613 laws of the OT — seeming in a somewhat arbitrary manner?

... Is it a blanket apples to apples comparison to compare someone as a Committee Leader or Board Member or Vestry Member or Elder to what the ESV text calls a Overseer or Deacon, or are they just clergy? Different denominations have different understandings of Elders and Deacons. Some don't have Elders or Deacons. Different churches have different understandings of the distinctions (if any) of ordained clergy and lay leaders.

So does this passage apply differently depending on your context, whether you are episcopal or presbyterian or congregational form of government? I just wonder.

 

Blogger Luke said ... (2:06 PM, June 18, 2004) : 

First - I think it should make you think. IF you have children who are not submissive by any stretch of the word (for example, if a child has a clinical diagnosis of "Oppositional/Defiant Disorder"), you should soberly reflect on whether you should be in a position of leadership. If, after as much spiritual consultation with the Lord as you can manage, you still feel led by the Spirit to assume a leadership role, then you should lead. IF followers have difficulty following BECAUSE of the nature of your children's behavior, you should step aside.

The point is leadership above reproach. And I think standards that lead to "reproach" have changed, over time, as has the role of children in society. I think there was a day and age in which a child with Tourettes Syndrome (forgive my spelling) would have been diagnosed differently than he or she would be now. Back then, it might have made a difference in the flock's ability and willingness to follow, and influence the acceptability of leadership.

If the behaviour of an overseer's children makes it difficult for the flock to follow, there is a problem that needs to be addressed. No stumbling blocks must be put before those of little or youthful faith...

 

Blogger theultrarev said ... (2:17 PM, June 18, 2004) : 

This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.

 

Blogger theultrarev said ... (2:17 PM, June 18, 2004) : 

Well said Luke.

 

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